MeiTanteixX

After rereading the "official" translation, I realized that maybe Sashihara gave two presents for Yamaki to deliver to the manager because the second one was for the the former salesgirl(that might've committed suicide), as an apology for her behavior...

Detective Conan FILE 969-970 Review/Discussion!

I never claimed that She never saw shinichi(I thought was pretty clear through my manga too). Before I get into the details of your interpretation, I have to state the big difference in our reasoning. the one underlying difference is regarding the vermouth scenes! I, personally, don't agree with the whole "Vermouth scenes are not placed chronologically in the timeline!" or that she was constantly lying! According to your reasoning, she saw Ai on the party. If she knew where to find Haibara, she would've taken action a lot earlier than the actual confrontation. This is proven by Conan's own thought process later on in File 458(which is 100% reliable when it comes to picking up odd/out of place events). That scene in File 458 started with him wondering "It would have been enough for Vermouth to disguise as someone from Teitan High if she thought that Sherry(adult form) was there"(1) and ended with the question "Why couldn't she find Haibara in Teitan Elementary, if she already knew of the possibility that she had shrunken?"(2). The only answer to the first question(1) is that She intentionally chose Araide because he goes to both of the schools, and the one link to those schools are her two treasures, Shinichi and Ran. The fact that the whole case(File 457-459) ended with Araide doubting Vermouth's threat(because of her constant act of kindness as Araide) might also be an indication that Vermouth intentionally chose Araide because he is a doctor, which gives her the opportunity to fulfill her beloved treasures' will(helping people with no ulterior motive other than doing good and probably also to redeem herself). There is a simple answer to the second question(2), which is not that she was just waiting for the right moment(otherwise, Gosho wouldn't address this question through Conan to begin with), but that Vermouth was never looking for Sherry when she joined Teitan to begin with! This is a strong indication that when she found Sherry in File 422, she truly must have found her then, which in turn would prove that the Vermouth scenes follows the chronology. First of all, it was Sonoko that mentioned Araide transferring and that was during Jodie's intro. Ran only said that Araide was gonna help directing the play. Secondly, Ran and Shinichi(who for some reason has shrunken) alone is enough reason to disguise as Araide, which of course is something she did right away! As I've stated before, Haibara was never a part of her plan at the beginning. There's no evidence to Vermouth being aware of Haibara's senses. When she revealed to Jodie that she was trying to lure the FBI into finding Sherry, she was holding Jodie at gunpoint, with no FBI allies close by and Calvados as her backup. By that point, she had no reason to lie and withhold too much info. Also, there was no reason to deny that Haibara(in other words, the woman in the photo) was her target, since she had no intention of hiding it when she outwardly said "Sherry" and was about to shoot Haibara in front of the wounded Jodie, minutes later. The FBI never bugged Agasa's house(at least not until Jodie arrived there), but rather Araide's(probably during their break-in). There's no indication that she was on the Bus to follow/get close to Haibara. Since she stole the police files directly after the Bus hijack, her true objective for entering the bus could have been to go to the police station in order to steal Araide's files to prepare for court, but then decided to take all of mouri's files(since she probably figured out that the FBI was after her in the Bus) and put her FBI-trap-plan in motion. By luring the FBI to the Mouri agency, she was able to find out about their break-in plan and from there on use the FBI to find Sherry. Akai's words was directed to Vermouth herself, since she is the FBI's target, meaning that Vermouth never revealed herself and took action against one of her targets that was there, "Cool guy"(in fact, she protected him, which left Jodie confused). By that point when she said that she was expecting that the FBI would find Sherry for her, like I mentioned before, Jodie was at death's door. The fact that Jodie knew about "Cool guy" only proves that she saw "Cool guy" on the dartboard, and nothing else. From my understanding, FBI has broken into her room more than once in order to find clues to Vermouth's target. It would be absurd if they tricked her into disguising as Araide without attempting to know why. the first break-in happened after she started going to school(which by that point, "Cool guy" and "Angel" were her only targets, which is what Jodie witnessed). The other known break-in(who knows after how many attempts) was after she realized that the FBI was after her(post bus hijack) and she found out about their operations and locations(which is why the order of the conversation, in File 433 pg 11, went from Vermouth talking about "finding out about FBI plans" to directly telling jodie that "she already knew about the break-in"). to put it simply: Before desperate revival: - Vermouth joins school as Araide (pins photos of Conan and Ran on dartboard) - Jodie breaks into her room (sees and takes photos of the photos and knows now who she should get close too) After desperate revival: - File 270, jodie is introduced and knows about vermouth's targets(talks to Akai about her current mission at the end of 272) - File 287, bus hijack happens and jodie brings "the newly introduced Akai" with her in order to make sure that Their target doesn't take actions against "Cool guy". - Vermouth figures out that the FBI are after her(during the hijack) and decides to steal all of Mouri's case files instead of just Araide's(probably her initial reason to entering the bus). - File 327, James meets Akai(since he came back from the US to help Jodie) and knows about Vermouth's target "Cool guy". - in File 330, Vermouth realizes that Conan is hiding sherry by piecing together Gin's description of the savior and Conan's voice-changing stunt! - Before File 335, Vermouth sends back the files, after File 337, Vermouth tricks the FBI and finds out about their plan to break-in(Pins photo of Sherry into dartboard in order to use the FBI who will later see it). - File 338, Jodie attempts to find out discreetly from Ran if she has witnessed Vermouth stalking her(Vermouth throws dart at photo at the end of 340). - Break in happens! Jodie and Akai now know that Sherry is one of her targets(the clinic gets bugged). - Akai sees Haibara at the end of the Itakura case(File 383). - File 417-418, Akai Attempts to investigate her. - File 420-422, during the Porsche case, Jodie sees Haibara, and at the end of the that case, Vermouth's finally finds Haibara and bugs Agasa's house(Burns Sherry's photo at the end of 422). ...the rest is history... In File 287, what she said was "I haven't found 'the one'", which was intentionally left ambiguous!(note that Gin and Vodka doesn't even know what she is looking for, so lying has no purpose there to begin with). As for who "the one" was, my interpretation to that is that she could be referring to 'the one' with the true potential of becoming her awaited "Silver Bullet". As for the FBI, I don't know what scene you are referring to where she says that she hasn't found what she is looking for. And how did she know that? It makes the most sense that she realized that the FBI was watching her when she had an opportunity to see Akai(someone she knows is from the FBI and who she met in NY), which is in the Bus hijack(Gosho intentionally chose these two to sit next to each other in robber disguise). That, in turn, lead to her being prepared to show the Sherry photo. Well, I'd say you are worrying too much. I'm not blindly following one direction without considering another, and I'm pretty sure that goes for DCUniverseAficionado too! What is the danger in possibly being wrong? I said: "I'd find it odd if the BO couldn't at the very least figure out the possibility that it might be saying "Asaca Rum"(like how Conan and Shuu did)." (note the "If")

Let's hope that happens.

anything is too early at this point (since DC has the tendency to use twists that deviate from the original suspicion)... I'm leaning more towards that the interpretation "Asaca=Rum" is wrong(whether the code is "Asaca Rum" or not). I'd find it odd if the BO couldn't at the very least figure out the possibility that it might be saying "Asaca Rum"(like how Conan and Shuu did). In fact, if they found something that looked like a dying message(the hand-mirror in this case), they are bound to make out the word "Rum"(the killer) before anything else, and then what's left is the name of the bodyguard, "Asaca"... Except we don't know how many factors were involved in that case yet. It's not like we are a couple of chapters away from the climax(where everything gets revealed). so any new info can could come up that could contradict with this early "simple answer"(that obviously goes for all the theories out there at the moment)... If Asaka isn't Mary, then my second option would be Rumi(Rum is my last option)... I can actually see enough "boobage" shape to be comparable to Mary's... That was a fun read! thanks for sharing your experience! ^^ As for Vermouth seeing, or wanting to get close to Ai... you might've noticed if you've read my fan manga, but I don't agree with this. There are numerous hints pointing to that she never intended to get close to Haibara when she joined Teitan and she never knew of Sherry's whereabouts(or shrunken state) until much later: - File 422 indicates that she found her(and realized that she had shrunken) just when she got an opportunity to see her. - File 433(pg 11) reveals that she didn't know where Sherry was, and so she tried to use the FBI to track her down. - File 458(pg 8) indicates that she had different reasons to joining Teitan High and Elementary School(which is obviously Ran and Conan). Exactly my point. Except...that's not a "wing"... it's "eyelashes"... Another funny interpretation is "Asaca <3(heart) Rum" xD (if "Asaca" was Mary, and "Rum" was Mr. Akai, would that mean "Asaca is married to Rum"? :P)

Either way, it's an exciting debate! Let's see who "Asaka" ends up being.... ....Mary VS Rumi...!

It's not so much that I doubt Sakurako completely, just that beyond the little notice of Conan's behavior, she hasn't shown any signs of becoming a potential plot character(I'll have to look back on her appearances to be sure though). I'd say Araide would've been a more convincing "plot-poential character" if I read File 330, or even the bus hijack case, for the first time...

1. They never mentioned that blood traces was found on the scissors... 3. Although I'm not completely on board with the details(since it could've gone multiple of ways at this point), I think Mary's latest behavior and knowledge makes sense with her being Asaka. Sera doesn't look to be well informed of the details regarding that case though... I know that, and I wasn't trying to pass it off as 100% confirmed fact, but rather more of an analysis of the implications and hints that where given in those instances. did those even exist? x) (I would like to know what long term fans that followed through the Vermouth arc thought at those moments) Except...he didn't, since he never looked back at James, up until the Kir arc... That whole "james Moriarty" scene was just a redherring(Conan himself played that idea off), and Conan was too distracted by Akai before he could even consider James to be suspicious... You probably meant "James black"... Yeah, but that's just if Gosho intended for james to become more than just a BO suspect, along with Akai... The biggest clue that there was a second Vermouth suspect(Araide) started from that scene in file 343...

What I meant was...it's too coincidental, even for DC standards, that Conan and Shuu would read out "Rum" from a dying message that never intended for it to be "Rum", and yet Rum was in the end truly the murderer... Then what was the purpose of code? To blame Rumi? If so, why didn't he just leave out "Asaca"?(since that would be Rumi's alias if she was the bodyguard)? And why would he blaming her in the first place when she's not Rum? If not, why was it so important for him leave her name in the message, instead of the culprit's? Conan was already getting suspicious over Araide ever since his wink at the Sato Omiai case. Combining it with Haibara's behavior in the bus and the later reveal of the stolen casefiles, it was most likely what triggered the suspicion that maybe there's an Impostor among them and that it's Chris from Haido city Hotel(who he knew could disguise herself, which he heard from Sharon) . Conan was never bothered by James.

Ok, I get what you mean now... I would welcome any future developments with Sakurako as plot character, I just have a hard time seeing it at the moment. At least in Araide's case, we got so much info of his family, his views/values and future plans and he showed the potential to become a recurring character, since he worked in Teitan... Does that mean that, at the moment, you're assuming that Rum was never involved and Kouji was just talking about "Wakasa Rumi"? Or that Rum was still involved and Kouji's message just happened to have the culprit's code-name in it when it wasn't intended? I'm guess the latter, because the moment their cause of death was said to be unknown(going even further back to the APTX list with Kouji's name), it was already confirmed that the BO was involved. in which case, it's a bit too absurd that "Rum" was "accidentally" read in the dying message. Yes, at least the interpretation of it "Asaca=Rum" seems too much like a red-herring that is supposed to stir up Conan's investigation(Akai might have something else in mind though)...As for the code "Asaca Rum" in general...that's why the "Carasuma" theory got resurrected to begin with...(I don't see why Kouji would attempt to write "Wakasa Rumi" without a "W" and "I" anyway)... That's what anyone would think at this moment, considering it was revealed in the same chapter that Mary is Sera and Akai's "mama"(which doesn't fit like a possible Rum candidate), and obviously, Conan's theory is only half true, since he's assuming that "Asaka" is Rum(Which is what Gosho wants the fans to think)... In the Vermouth arc, Conan did consider a third suspicious person(Araide) besides Jodie and Akai, during the same scene when Conan and Heiji were talking about Jodie's face... Gosho is definitely gonna make Conan notice her, since she's already apparent as a "Asaca"/Rum suspect to the fans(Which I'm 100% Gosho intended that), and she would become more suspicious if Conan didn't address her and her name. Maybe the father's involvement became a distraction...? or maybe Rum poisoned Amanda through her tea, contrary to Kouji, without coming into contact with Asaka, and realized that a bodyguard(witness) had fled the scene afterwards...? Who knows.... we will have to wait see where the plot is heading before we ask about these details... Even Mothers(depending on the circumstance) can do some spy/protection-work, and considering that Elena might've still been alive at that point(although death "a year" after Shiho's birth sounds too long for something that was said to be "not long after her birth"), Helping her sister could have been her drive to working(even after giving birth to masumi). Is it even confirmed that they lived in Japan 17 yrs ago? maybe the Kouji incident(which probably lead to the father's death) made them move to Japan. I think Shuukichi's financial status comes from his shogi career or/and from his adoptive family(since Kouji should've been rich too), rather than from his own family(besides, Yumi has only seen him since college). Maybe he Rum used other clues to figure her Asaka identity(like the hand-mirror)... all of these details can be easily explained if Gosho already has a full picture in mind. Right now, it's still a bit too early in the story to answer anything completely... Same here,... for now, let's start with focusing on the upcoming flashback case(if it's coming at all)...

that's assuming he lost it at that time... Where does Kuroda's accident fit in in the Rum arc? As a Rum suspect, he should be connected to Rum in some shape or form(like how FBI was to Vermouth, how Eisuke was to Kir or How Subaru and Sera was to Bourbon)... I think Rum's accident might be linked with Kuroda's(which is how Kuroda comes into play in this arc)...

What Jimmy was suggesting was whether Kuroda came to pick up is daughter(if it's Sakurako)... Sakurako's connection to Rum+accident was your idea... Not really. The way that information was delivered, it was as if it was supposed to be passed off as nothing but exposition for Haibara to explain how she knew the original words "Put on Mascara". Rumi's name however is screaming for attention. Adding to the fact that her age was deliberately pointed out(by Rumi herself), indirectly saying that she's old enough to be "Asaka", and physical skills being shown off later on, makes it even more suspicious, hence "too obvious"(she's literally "jodie" of the Rum arc). Being in disguise shouldn't be a problem for someone who's probably an MI6 agent(she would only need a wig anyway in order to look like the photo). Since the hand-mirror ended up with Kouji, after most likely being with Asaka, it could be indicating that an interaction between them happened(since shuukichi admired him since he was at max 11 yrs, maybe Kouji and Mary knew each other). Meaning that maybe he got some intel of her and Amanda's situation and was trying to warn "Asaca" that "Rum" is after her. the hint in the hand-mirror could mean anything at this point, depending on the future developments... Gosho could still be going with the more simpler route that the mirror really is saying that Rum is indeed "Asaka" and that we are going through the stage where we are getting Rum/Asaka suspects who are connected in one way or another to the Kouji case/Rum. Or, Gosho is going with a more "twisty" route where the mirror is hinting to something else, where "Asaka" and Rum are different people. In this case, Mary's involvement in the Kouji case fits the most if she was "Asaka". Gosho knows what kind of indications he's giving out through his story telling, so if he's trying to lure people with the impression that "Asaka"=Rum, no one would suspect that the Akai mother(Mary) is Asaka(even if Conan points out that possibility) since that would imply that she is Rum.

Interesting analysis, that does hold some logical grounds to Sakurako's reappearances. I wouldn't mind that kind of development, but that only stems on the fact Kuroda is neither Rum/Mr.Akai/or anything in that regard... which I guess makes things less interesting IMO... It's too obvious and more like a redherring, and although Conan is in the dark of her potential, Gosho has definitely given her enough attention for us think that she is Asaka. Mary being "Asaka" holds more proof if u add the hand-mirror(that Haibara specifically said her mother also owned[Mary's potential sister]) into the mix. As for Rumi...

it's very likely that he was thinking that maybe his mother(who he might've heard was involved in the Kouji case as "Asaca") came back to Japan with Sera in secret. When he figured out the code "Asaca Rum", maybe he was thinking that Kouji was warning whoever solved the code that "Rum" is after "Asaca", hence Akai trying to verify her location through Ran and Sonoko.

Yeah! you're pretty much proving my point. Not to mention the resemblence between the potential cousins(Akai = Kir, Eisuke = Shuukichi) and Gosho’s own way of saying that Hidemi resembles Shuichi(by having Akai admit Kir to Haido hospital as his "sister").

Yeah, I'm just handing out ideas but I'm already seeing him as a CIA agent and also a friend of the Hondou's, who's sister married Ethan.

Haneda Shuukichi = Sera Masumi and Akai Shuichi's brother/ Haneda Kouji's adopted brother No arguments there since it's practically confirmed. The Boy from 10 yrs ago is probably still Shuukichi. If he was in a sitting-position for some reason, it could explain the exaggerated height difference between him and his mother. Mary = Sera Masumi and Akai Shuichi's mother/ Former MI6/SIS agent / "Asaka" She was involved in the Kouji case because of Amanda Hughes. Amanda might've been investing to the BO, and because she feared for her life(maybe because her connections to the FBI/CIA came to BO's notice) she decides to hire "Asaka"(Mary in disguise) maybe through the recommendations of James Black(the family friend of the Akais) or maybe Mary was infiltrating the BO at that time but was blackmailed(Mary's identity being at stake) by Amanda to protect her. the hand-mirror belonged to Mary(similar to Elena's, her sister), which was why "Asaka" was seen with it. When Amanda and Asaka met Kouji, somehow, Mary's hand-mirror ended up with Kouji. Rum appeared and killed Amanda and Kouji, but Asaka/Mary managed to escape(Which was Rum's 17-year-old mess up). at least 7 years later(probably after Mary and Masumi moved back to the US, in other words, around 14-16 yrs later) Rum finds Asaka/Mary and attempts to kill her with the APTX/SB prototype, but she shrinks instead. She then decides take her daughter and flee to Japan in order to find her niece(Shiho) and seek help. Kuroda Hyoue (pre-coma, 10 years ago) = NPA Officer He might've been Furuya's boss. The accident was caused due to an incident which most likely involved Rum. Rum's eye accident could've been from the same one. Kuroda Hyoue (post-coma) = Former NPA Officer(?) and Nagano Police First Division Chief / Tokyo Police First Division Mangaing Officer / Rum(???) He might still be Furuya's boss. He could be someone else in disguise as the former Kuroda, like Rum, or he really did lose some of his memories after the accident and lost his hair color do to the stress from the accident. It's still not clear whether he really is off the table or not as a Rum suspect, since Haibara's senses has been off at alarming times before, and there's no confirmation that Rum has seen Shiho as a kid. Wakasa Rumi = Haneda Kouji's lover/sister/relative/childhood friend Her being the one behind the "Kouji case info upload" sounds like the most likely possibility. The Soul Detective case made it to the papers(since Gin knew about it), so Rumi could have gotten her interest to the Mouri's involvement there, only to later find that Conan is the brain behind "sleeping Kogoro"(after doing the same investigation as Eisuke). Her goal is to find "Asaka"(which she suspects to be Kouji's killer), which is why she's probably going with a name that has Kouji's dying message inserted in(W-"ACASA RUM"-I), in order to specifically test Conan's intellectual capabilities(since she might be suspecting that Conan was involved in the "Soul detective" case because he was interested in Kouji's case). Mr. Akai ("Kiritake"/"Zumu"(?)) = Former CIA Agent(???)/Private Detective(???)/Rum(???) The CIA was mentioned in the Kouji case, because of Amanda's connections. Akai Shuichi's father was mentioned to be involved in the Kouji case and the reason to Akai joining the FBI. If Akai's father is from CIA, it could explain how Amanda hired "Asaka"/Mary(his wife) and how Shuichi got CIA intel of Ethan Hondou's full background. If Akai's father was a private detective, it could mean that he got himself involved to the case in order to help his wife. If he's Rum, it would mean that he faked his death and was hunting his own wife(if she is "Asaka" ofc), which sounds a bit far-fetched. Yonehara Sakurako = Rum(Just kidding, she is just there because of comedic reliefs and an excuse for the VA to get involved in DC)

That's assuming that Conan wasn't just imagining the two unknowns together, rather than them actually standing beside each other... Shuukichi's(unknown boy's) design is definitely looking off, and Gosho is usually not someone to mess up character art, but I still think that unless it's nothing, we will still get a good explanation for that appearance and that he is indeed still Shuukichi, the middle bro.

I wouldn't say the old man having the height of a "normal adult"(If the picture that @Jimmy-kud0-tv2 posted is what you're referring to). Besides, when your legs are crossed, while sitting on the floor, your height will seem shorter than when you're on your knee.

Yes, it's intentional... I'm basically saying that I'm expecting a new subplot through Wakasa, rather than her connecting to the other agencies. Not saying that she couldn't be an undercover agent, only that I'm personally doubting her being connected to an already introduced agency. Camel was btw introduced in context where it was heavily focusing on FBI, while Wakasa hasn't even been hinted at to be an agent yet...

There's nothing wrong with the name "Wakasa Rumi". It's only outside the "Detective Conan" universe that it's a "rum"-like name... Personally, I think that it's too over the top for Gosho to introduce a new suspicious character only to reveal that it's an undercover agent sent out by Kuroda(whose general motives are yet unknown). And obviously, Bourbon's interest lies on Akai, whom he already has Okiya as suspect for. Even if he was interested in Conan's involvement, or ordered to send out an undercover agent, with his investigational skills and advantages as Mouri's apprentice, it would be completely unnecessary for him rely on another agent who's a stranger to the target. Whether Rumi is Rum/undercover agent or not, It's very doubtful that Gosho is not gonna introduce a new subplot(unrelated to the other agencies/bureaus) through Wakasa, but she will most likely tie in to the Rum plot, one way or the other. So far, her eyes seems to be normal, and she doesn't seem to have any "old" features of some sort. then there's the whole code-naming-pattern of BO members for males/females that indicates that Rum is male. Considering the number of code-named males in the BO has increased by one after Bourbon, Gosho might try to make it even with a new female member(hence making an exception to the "naming pattern", maybe even give an acceptable excuse for her character). She seems to be watching over Conan, with knowledge of his intelligence, which most likely makes her either connected to someone that knows about Conan's intelligence or someone that investigated Mouri/Kudo, which lead her to Conan.

Vermouth Manga Part 3 Preview! DC - Behind The Black Curtains - Vermouth (3) P.S. There's a "NEXT PAGE" ;)

This is beautiful! I especially love how you drew Misaki!