Regarding the Roller Coaster murder case.

[Eisuke 3]

I have a slight problem with the method of murder. The gymnast girl had to turn around and lean over Shinichi while in a pitch black tunnel. Surely the Meitantei Shinichi must have felt some woman leaning over him. The same goes with the gymnast's friend. She didn't notice her friend's legs moving around beside her face?

[detective-db 16]

I thought that he gripped his feet on the bar and seems like floating on top of Shinichi (not leaning)

But i think that's what Detective Conan is all about MYSTERIOUS! "

[Kyuu Nye 425]

I thought that he gripped his feet on the bar and seems like floating on top of Shinichi (not leaning)

But i think that's what Detective Conan is all about MYSTERIOUS! "

Yes, according to the mock scenario that was shown in the manga file and in the anime, she never ONCE made contact with Shinichi. Why would he feel anything if she was over him? He likely could hear her clothes, but there would be no reason for him to assume that it was her clothes, instead of his own or Ran's.

So in a pitch black tunnel, with all senses skewed except for touch (pitch black kills sight, smell obscured by wind, hearing obscured by wind, taste... well that's kinda useless here, isn't it?), Shinichi, who never felt her as she was over him, could not know it was her without the proper evidence.

[greaterbeastxellas 1]

Wasn't there a tear drop that hit Shinichi? How would he explain that outside of everything else even if he didn't notice the necklace before?

[MadelineLime 45]

While she didn't touch him, most people "feel" when someone is super close to them. I know I do... then again this is Shinichi

[Kyuu Nye 425]

While she didn't touch him, most people "feel" when someone is super close to them. I know I do... then again this is Shinichi

She could have done it fast enough so that he wouldn't "feel" her. I don't know... All I know is that he didn't notice her for one reason or another, and it isn't all that odd that he didn't either.

[MadelineLime 45]

I don't think it's possible to do that fast enough for the senses to not notice.

[Chekhov MacGuffin 1089]

It's not the touching/not touching that is the problem here. Shinichi should have noticed that the wind from the ride was obviously blocked by some obstruction. Also, Vodka should have gotten blood on his face, and possibly should have been hit by the severed head as it flew back. Now that I think about it, it was probably Vodka, not the dead guy, who yelled behind Shinichi right before Shinichi felt the blood. There would be no time for the dead guy to yell and the necklace being put on him would have confused him rather than frightened him.

Chek has a pet theory the reason Gin and Vodka didn't run away before the police arrived is because they were too busy cleaning themselves up. They couldn't leave while covered in blood.

[Sherlock Lupin 41]

It's not the touching/not touching that is the problem here. Shinichi should have noticed that the wind from the ride was obviously blocked by some obstruction. Also, Vodka should have gotten blood on his face, and possibly should have been hit by the severed head as it flew back. Now that I think about it, it was probably Vodka, not the dead guy, who yelled behind Shinichi right before Shinichi felt the blood. There would be no time for the dead guy to yell and necklace being put on him would have confused him rather than frightened him.

Chek has a pet theory the reason Gin and Vodka didn't run away before the police arrived is because they were too busy cleaning themselves up. They couldn't leave while covered in blood.

As usual, Chek has a solution for everything. I pronounce thee "Most Likely to Actually Solve a Case"

[Kyuu Nye 425]

It's not the touching/not touching that is the problem here. Shinichi should have noticed that the wind from the ride was obviously blocked by some obstruction. Also, Vodka should have gotten blood on his face, and possibly should have been hit by the severed head as it flew back. Now that I think about it, it was probably Vodka, not the dead guy, who yelled behind Shinichi right before Shinichi felt the blood. There would be no time for the dead guy to yell and necklace being put on him would have confused him rather than frightened him.

Chek has a pet theory the reason Gin and Vodka didn't run away before the police arrived is because they were too busy cleaning themselves up. They couldn't leave while covered in blood.

Chek, is it not possible that with her physique and skill, she went to the far side (the side closest to the edge with the rail) minimizing the blocking of the wind? This would also account for there being no chance for her to touch Shinichi, causing further reason for Shinichi not to notice. She didn't need to be directly in front to put the necklace around the victim.

Shinichi felt a "tear" not blood as I recall.

And that is an interesting theory. I like it.

Also... of all people, I don't think Gin nor Vodka would be bothered by blood or a severed head. Surprised perhaps, but their first instinct would probably be to get cleaned up as you said.

[Chekhov MacGuffin 1089]

Chek, is it not possible that with her physique and skill, she went to the far side (the side closest to the edge with the rail) minimizing the blocking of the wind? This would also account for there being no chance for her to touch Shinichi, causing further reason for Shinichi not to notice. She didn't need to be directly in front to put the necklace around the victim.

Shinichi felt a "tear" not blood as I recall.

And that is an interesting theory. I like it.

Also... of all people, I don't think Gin nor Vodka would be bothered by blood or a severed head. Surprised perhaps, but their first instinct would probably be to get cleaned up as you said.

It would be damn unstable to lean over the side because most of the burden would be on one leg and it would still alter the wind from that side. Regarding the blood, the order of the scene is this: Shinichi felt the tear, someone screamed behind Shinichi, then Shinichi screamed after he felt the blood from behind (along with Ran), and everyone kicked up a ruckus after that.

[Kyuu Nye 425]

It would be damn unstable to lean over the side because most of the burden would be on one leg and it would still alter the wind from that side. Regarding the blood, the order of the scene is this: Shinichi felt the tear, someone screamed behind Shinichi, then Shinichi screamed after he felt the blood from behind (along with Ran), and everyone kicked up a ruckus after that.

Not what I meant. What I meant was not over the side but to one side entirely, locking her legs into one side of the harness, instead of the middle bar on each side, the bar on the far right (if the cars are facing you). If she locked her left leg to the middle portion and interlocked her right around the outside of the right, she should have been able to be far enough off center to prevent wind from being blocked. With her build and skill as a gymnast, she should have been able to do such a feat. And honestly, it would make sense to me that she would want to do that because she wouldn't want to risk touching Shinichi.

Looking over the file again, I see what you mean, I totally forgot about that... Though that bothers me... Shinichi nor Ran should have never felt the blood... The heart doesn't pump that strongly so that it could go against physics (as in the forward motion of the car plus the wind) and gush THAT much. It just doesn't, Gosho should have consulted his brother about the strength of the human heart pumping, because even when the heart is racing from adrenaline due to a roller coaster ride, its not strong enough to make that effect. There might have been a light blood spray from the initial cut, but that would not have made it to Shinichi on a roller coaster. Unless all I learned about kinematics is wrong...

[Eisuke 3]

While she didn't touch him, most people "feel" when someone is super close to them. I know I do... then again this is Shinichi

I guess in a narrow tunnel you wouldn't notice the feeling of someone over you if that's what you're expecting from the tunnel.

[Chekhov MacGuffin 1089]

Not what I meant. What I meant was not over the side but to one side entirely, locking her legs into one side of the harness, instead of the middle bar on each side, the bar on the far right (if the cars are facing you). If she locked her left leg to the middle portion and interlocked her right around the outside of the right, she should have been able to be far enough off center to prevent wind from being blocked. With her build and skill as a gymnast, she should have been able to do such a feat. And honestly, it would make sense to me that she would want to do that because she wouldn't want to risk touching Shinichi.

Looking over the file again, I see what you mean, I totally forgot about that... Though that bothers me... Shinichi nor Ran should have never felt the blood... The heart doesn't pump that strongly so that it could go against physics (as in the forward motion of the car plus the wind) and gush THAT much. It just doesn't, Gosho should have consulted his brother about the strength of the human heart pumping, because even when the heart is racing from adrenaline due to a roller coaster ride, its not strong enough to make that effect. There might have been a light blood spray from the initial cut, but that would not have made it to Shinichi on a roller coaster. Unless all I learned about kinematics is wrong...

Using the method you suggest is not enough to not block the wind. The guard bar is not very wide, so her butt would still be about half in front of Shinichi even with the right skewed leg bracing technique you suggest. She would have to be hanging considerably over the right side of the cart with her chest parallel to the side of the cart to avoid blocking the wind significantly, and as I said that is an unstable position with the required leg brace because most of the weight is on one leg thus it will be more prone to slipping sideways along the bar. I can can draw a picture explaining later today if you like.

Blood in the vertebral arteries on average at peak systole flows at .75 m/sec, so putting that into the standard no air resistance constant linear acceleration equation would give you about 3 cm of spurt height for a clean cut artery. http://www.dirjournal.org/pdf/pdf_DIR_45.pdf

[Kyuu Nye 425]

Using the method you suggest is not enough to not block the wind. The guard bar is not very wide, so her butt would still be about half in front of Shinichi even with the right skewed leg bracing technique you suggest. She would have to be hanging considerably over the right side of the cart with her chest parallel to the side of the cart to avoid blocking the wind significantly, and as I said that is an unstable position with the required leg brace because most of the weight is on one leg thus it will be more prone to slipping sideways along the bar. I can can draw a picture explaining later today if you like.

Blood in the vertebral arteries on average at peak systole flows at .75 m/sec, so putting that into the standard no air resistance constant linear acceleration equation would give you about 3 cm of spurt height for a clean cut artery. http://www.dirjournal.org/pdf/pdf_DIR_45.pdf

Perhaps you are not familiar with pole acrobatics, aka chinese poles. It is completely and entirely possible to get the position needed using the method I suggested.

Yup, chinese pole acrobatics. I think it could work. The same amount of leg would be required to stabilize as Shinichi used to demonstrate it too (up to the knee). Just because Shinichi did not/could not do it in his demonstration does not mean its impossible for someone with the proper training.

As for the arterial cut, then yeah... Not enough... 3cm spurt with an initial acceleration of .75m/s in conditions at speed ranging from 48-129kmh, with air resistance and extreme wind.... There is no way the blood made it the likely 1m distance to Shinichi and Ran.

[Chekhov MacGuffin 1089]

Perhaps you are not familiar with pole acrobatics, aka chinese poles. It is completely and entirely possible to get the position needed using the method I suggested.

I am familiar enough with it but you have to consider several points. 1. We are talking about gymnastics, not chinese pole gripping. Women's gymnastics never deals with leg bracing/gripping. 2. She a woman and thus has less strength to work with than the dude in the video.

I talked about this with a letterman gymnast, and she concurred with my assessment that a single pole grip is liable to be unsteady because the brace points are closer together. If might not be a problem on a steady system, but the jerking coaster and the dark which removes visual cues makes it a most likely unreliable posture.

[Kyuu Nye 425]

I am familiar enough with it but you have to consider several points. 1. We are talking about gymnastics, not chinese pole gripping. Women's gynnastics does not deal with leg bracing/gripping. 2. She a woman and thus has less strength to work with than the dude in the video.

I talked about this with a letterman gymnast, and she concurred with my assessment that a single pole or a heavily skewed sideways brace would not be easy, especially on an unsteady surface.

1) We don't know her training or range of experience. We only know what Shinichi deduced. 2) There are women who do Chinese Pole Gymnastics.

There is a woman of similar body type doing it. And the pole is... unstable and moving 3) I never said it was easy, just possible.

EDIT: Granted, the pole moving in that video is not going at 49kmh. Still proves that it is possible for a woman of similar body type to do it on an unstable platform.

[Chekhov MacGuffin 1089]

1) We don't know her training or range of experience. We only know what Shinichi deduced. 2) There are women who do Chinese Pole Gymnastics.

There is a woman of similar body type doing it. And the pole is... unstable and moving 3) I never said it was easy, just possible.

Chinese pole gymnastics is very rare. I think it is reasonable to rule it out. Also, the marks on her thighs from the bar are solely perpendicular, whereas Chinese pole forms occur at multiple angles and would create wider angle marks on her thighs. Also, unstable and moving is fine when you are used to it. The uneven parallel bars move quite a bit during rotations, but as that is a predictable movement, it is learned and accommodated for in training. It is a world apart from a jerky coaster in the dark where you have no visual compensation for balance.

As for possible, I trust my gymnast source's evaluation that her plan would be unsteady and slip prone (meaning she runs into Shinichi or collides with the guy while trying to loop him) if she did not use the relatively stable brace that Shinichi demonstrated, which of course creates the why did Shinichi not notice conundrum.

[Kyuu Nye 425]

Chinese pole gymnastics is very rare. I think it is reasonable to rule it out. Also, the marks on her thighs from the bar are solely perpendicular, whereas Chinese pole forms occur at multiple angles and would create wider angle marks on her thighs. Also, unstable and moving is fine when you are used to it. The uneven parallel bars move quite a bit during rotations, but as that is a predictable movement, it is learned and accommodated for in training. It is a world apart from a jerky coaster in the dark where you have no visual compensation for balance.

As for possible, I trust my gymnast source's evaluation that her plan would be unsteady and slip prone (meaning she runs into Shincihi or collides with the guy while trying to loop him) if she did not use the relatively stable brace that Shinichi demonstrated, which of course creates the why did Shinichi not notice conundrum.

Must I quote Sherlock Holmes? "when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth"

If we assume that Shinichi would have noticed the lack of wind created by his scenario, then despite its difficulties and inherent improbability, my scenario would be the most logical, as it is a possible method, because it is simply not impossible.

However, if we assume that Shinichi didn't notice, or was distracted by the tear drop that hit him before it occurred thus preventing him from noticing the break in wind, then the former scenario is the most probable, as it is the simplest and most possible scenario.

[Detective Kudo 28]

It could have been the mere excitement of the rollercoaster that caused Kudo to be distracted. Even if the wind was blocked, with Ran holding his hand and him thinking about her would be enough to zone him out. We are assuming he was thinking about his surroundings the whole time. Remember the plane murder case? All it took was for Ran to fall asleep on his shoulder to be completely distracted. My guess is she moved quickly to pull that off in the first place and knew the ride well. What probably brought Kudo back from his thoughts was the cold wet teardrop that hit his face. However you guys bring up valid points. This murder trick was a bit sketchy

[Wicky 11]

... This is not answerable as none of us is Shinici, even though you may insist you are X'D