Chekhov MacGuffin
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Posts posted by Chekhov MacGuffin
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8 hours ago, MeiTanteixX said:Looking at it from an "object" perspective... it does look like it could be a horse(knight) chess piece.
looks similar to yours @Chekhov MacGuffin
If you arrived at that conclusion independently, I feel better about it. I didn't know what to expect when I started my shadowshape sketch, but
yourone's subconcious loves to bias things even ifyou wantone wants to be completely objective. I wonder how other people will think. -
That shape is even more shogi-like than before, but now it's especially clear there is still more junk in the trunk. The second thingamajig is now more complicated so it absolutely is not another shogi piece as I earlier theorized. That deep shadow on the upper right part means it definitely has some bulk on one side, like it has a round base which tapers into another shape. I, without prejudice, scribbled a shape I thought best matched the shadows from my artistic perspective and it came out looking like a lopsided chess piece? Because it is kinda lopsided, a knight because that's the only one that isn't symmetric?
Edit: the relative sizes are kinda questionable though, now that I look harder. It might be too small to be a chess piece even if the shape maybe fits. I'm not going to take it back or fix my artistic impression though because that would be twisting my "data" (more like my immediate innocent first reaction to the shape) to suit theories.
Edit Edit: I did kinda draw my shogi piece a bit large, I think I could shrink that just a bit still maintain the correct lines and shape.
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Now that I have read the full case and have more case context, I think there is a more-than decent chance the other hat guy could be involved as well. (and he could be the shadowman)
Anyone innocent finding a lost item after a jarring incident would ask the surrounding people if it was theirs. Thus I am inclined to think the boy and his father are the actual owners of the Sanada (19) charm, because they were expecting to find it when they dropped it and got Higo (9) instead. I don't think they look like the type who would steal and keep the wrong charm. That means that someone else got Sanada.
I'm going to guess the incident went something like this. Sneaky shadowdude wanted the Higo charm (thought Higo gave it to Ai from nearby in the stands?). He pressed emergency stop or conveniently the train came to a sudden halt and the two charms went flying along with the detective badge. Shadowman didn't realize there were two at the time. The father-son couple grabbed the wrong charm before shadowman could get Higo, and thus the shadowman was left holding Sanada and didn't realize it at first because the numbers are similar. By the time he figured it out, dad and kid were long gone with Higo. So shadowman came up with a plan. He would drop the Sanada charm off at a convenient lost and found (Chiyari-cho rather than Baker-cho) and then wait for the duo to realize their error and collect it. He would wait around for them. Shadowman would tell the father/son he dropped the Higo charm on the train, picked up Sanada by mistake, and was hoping he could have his Higo back. Shadowman's plan had an interloper in the form of the DB looking for the Higo charm, so the shadowman is probably worried that if they find the couple before he does, he will lose out on Higo. I'm not sure who (shadowman or dad n' son) has the badge or if they even know they have the badge and it didn't land in some clothing somehow.
Finding the boy and his dad: Both boy and father have intense glove tans on both hands, so they both do something outside (probably together) with hats and gloves on both hands in intense sunlight (so not baseball or golf, where players wear gloves on one hand). The father is also thoroughly tanned on the whole length of his leg below his shorts (not baseball again because they wear long pants for sliding). The lack of shinguard tan means he isn't on the field as a ref or something, not that I would expect him to be soccer related anyway since he mixed up the charm. Combined with his steadiness on his feet and the bulky square object in the bag, and we have a pretty mystery. Tennis players sometimes wear gloves (but not often, wristbands are more common) and short pants, and a racket might explain the bulge, but not the shape. Sports cameraman might make sense, but to not know the numbers of the players is questionable.
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5 hours ago, MeiTanteixX said:It was Mitsuhiko's phone. Earlier spoiler pics just had the panel of Amuro reaching for a phone Conan was holding. I assumed it was Conan's since he was holding it, but it was the wrong color. But now I want to know about the bartender friend that Agasa lent his beetle to. Jii (more billiards than a bar) or Yuzu?
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This shadowman is bound to be a case culprit rather than a major person. If there is any action to keep one eye on now, it is why Okiya needed Amuro to go away from Kudo's house for a while and also that Amuro is up to trying to get a hold of Conan's phone.
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On 7/9/2017 at 11:28 AM, Otaku3670 said:I just spotted an anomaly(?) in chapter 899. Just when Shukichi gets to leave the Shogi finals to save Yumi, Chikara looks up at him. Which is pretty obvious but what is more baffling is the way he's depicted as looking up to Shukichi.
Gosho seems to give the readers an exclusive direct/face to face shot of Shukichi,while putting the supposed manga-reader in an oblique place just behind Chikara.
So from the reader's perspective Chikara should look a bit oblique(as mentioned in my diagram), but the obliquity wouldn't entail the user to see his eyeball as it would be focused on Shukichi.
The real issue here is that Chikara's face should exactly face Shukichi as he's looking directly at him.
From viewer's perspective Chikara looks more tilted towards his(Chikara's) left. His left eyeball should be more close to his nose bridge than it's in reality.
As if Chikara tilted his head a little to his left to get a fuller view of Shukichi, and the positioning of his left eyeball also is somewhat odd. It looks rather to be focused on the left than on Shukichi.
Generally our line of vision is exactly perpendicular to the imagined Vertical plane which just touches the back of our head when we're moving our head to focus on something. In the case of Chikara's left eyeball the line of vision is not locked on Shukichi.
Chikara can very well have a Prosthetic eye.
I spent a lot of time counting the directions characters' heads are facing for a personal project. This slight turning of the face is normal for Gosho and other western and eastern comics alike because it looks better and allows the reader to see more expressions instead of the back of people's heads. It doesn't mean anything unusual and if you look on other pages you will see the same oblique turning.
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See this guy, with the hat, glove tan, and the bag with a big rectangular bag bulge? I'm calling him for now as the shadowman lurker. There is another guy nearby in a matching cap and jacket, but he isn't drawn with near as much detail.
Also did Conan just grab that woman's butt to stabilize himself? -
https://www.strawpoll.me/13277646
Everyone, please consider voting in round two of the who is Rum poll! (Kor's 25th strawpoll)
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On 6/21/2017 at 1:14 AM, Otaku3670 said:The method that you mentioned still won't explain the smaller fragments still sticking on the casing of the "U MASCARA" part. To be elaborate, we can see exactly similar residue in the black-boxed area.
We also can't find the residue of the glass containing "EL" of Juke Hotel.
The explanation that I can give is just like the "EL", "U MASCARA" had not been photographed separately(like the mirror or Kohji's hand).
Juke's presence is worrisome as you've mentioned.
But I also tend to think that this coincidental mirror clue revealed a good part of Rum's social name, that's why BO boss and Rum are so edgy about it.
The method I described does work. You are basically cracking glass along a line of pressure provided by pressing the edge of scissors against it. You can't expect clean breaks without scoring the glass, not will all the pieces fall out, nor will all the residue fall out either. There is also probably some sort of glue-like substance meant to hold the mirror into the backing too.
Quick cbox transcript
Kor: planned to wait with another rum poll until 1000 but since it doesn't seem 1000 will have anything to do with that, and it's so far away (if gosho delays it even more, pokemon may reach 1000 episodes before we reach 1000 files ), I may do it in the upcoming days instead. 22 Jun 17, 12:34
Kor: We don't have that much more hints than the last time (file 920), but we do have more characters, so... 22 Jun 17, 12:34
Kor: results from the first ever RumPoll™ http://s23.postimg.org/ckgnb5v57/Screen_Shot_2015_04_01_at_12_32_32_AM.png 22 Jun 17, 12:35
Kor: top options were: A person who switched places with Kuroda mid-coma, and Another character that appeared in the past 22 Jun 17, 12:36
Chek: I think the Kohji case changed a lot. 22 Jun 17, 12:47
Chek: It provided a direction: could I see X character kdoing this crime. Also the revealof three suspects helped too I think. 22 Jun 17, 12:50
Chek: Have you redone the poll any? 22 Jun 17, 12:50
Kor: not entirely sure what this question means 22 Jun 17, 13:03
Chek: Sorry, I meant have you rerun the poll to see how beliefs have evolved in the intervening time? 22 Jun 17, 16:19
Kor: About Rum? Not yet. 22 Jun 17, 16:26
Kor: Rundown of story relevant plot results: 22 Jun 17, 16:28
Kor: "What's your speculation regarding Kuroda?" <--- top result: He's another some sort of an agent who will fight against the BO eventually
Kor: Rum's identity: as noted below. 22 Jun 17, 16:28
Kor: "What's Chiba's first name?" <--- top result: Keiji 22 Jun 17, 16:29
Kor: "What do you think is the true purpose behind APTX 4869?" <--- top result: reverse aging 22 Jun 17, 16:29
Kor: "What do you think is Rum's main objective?" <--- top result: Find infiltrators or traitors in the organization 22 Jun 17, 16:30
Kor: "What do you think was the affiliation of Shuichi's father?" <--- top result: He was in the Black Organization 22 Jun 17, 16:32
Kor: "Who do you think is Wakasa Rumi?" <--- top result: Asaka (but not Rum) 22 Jun 17, 16:33
Kor: some more trivial matters: "Who do you think is the character with the odd eyes that is hinted at the latest movie 20 promotional video?" <--- top result was Rum (second from the top is a movie only character). 22 Jun 17, 16:36
Kor: Also the Scotch poll has a bit of a muddy conclusion. https://image.prntscr.com/image/XF5TrtAISee_REBaMzr0rA.png <--- Akai was kinda responsible (and also kinda not), and Scotch also killed himself, and also Amuro misunderstood 22 Jun 17, 16:37
Kor: wait forgot something in my "random crap we're still waiting for Gosho to resolve and it's part of the akai family stuff" list from a few weeks ago. Over 100 files ago we got that sentence from from MG for Masumi to tell conan that she's “the little sister from outside the domain”. Conan still has no clue what it means and he hasn't really pondered about that at all. 22 Jun 17, 16:47
Kor: Considering Conan already figured out who MG is (and by figure out, I mean, he overheard Masumi refer to that girl as mom), not sure he really needs to decode that sentence. Wonder if Gosho forgot about it. 22 Jun 17, 16:48
Chek: That's super interesting. I'd love to see the Rum poll rerun. 22 Jun 17, 17:24
Chek: And maybe a what is the meaning of the dying message mirror: ASACA RUM, WAKASA RUMI, KARASUMA, part of a bigger message, was not intentionally made, etc 22 Jun 17, 17:26
Chek: The not intentionally made theory is pretty interesting, although I am zero% buying the reasons people are presenting like the so called debris 22 Jun 17, 17:33
Chek: As if a mirror is expected to crack perfectly without residue and have all the broken pieces fall out neatly. Besides, some of the markings could be material that sticks the mirror to the backing. And it is concerning that none of the "cut out letters" are shown around the mirror, although other pieces that don't matter to the message like the heart and the wing are. 22 Jun 17, 17:36
Kor: ugh, I can buy Akai and Conan reaching the wrong conclusion about the meaning of the message, but this is a mystery series. If a clue is actually not a clue at all but something of pure coincidence then that just makes the author a dick. 22 Jun 17, 17:37
Chek: The surprise might be then hand clue I pointed out a bit ago. 22 Jun 17, 17:37
Chek: My thoughts on the mirror being a "juke" are as follows. 1) The edges of the frame of the mirror are more undamaged than I would like them to be if the miror was cut or poked with scissors. 2) Second, the sink being on in the wrong room presents a potential problem to the mirror clue's creation if and only if Kohji didn't have a reasonable opportunity and sensible plan to take advantage of it. We can't resolve this until we know the layout. 22 Jun 17, 17:41
Chek: There would also have to be another reason for the sink to be left on. 22 Jun 17, 17:41
Chek: A red herring mirror + a juke that none of the three presented suspects are guilty. Maybe that's the theme of the arc. 22 Jun 17, 17:43
Chek: Mary coincidentally saying the same thing as Gin ... This arc might be all about the fakeouts, where Gosho didn't bother before as much.
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I replied in the DCTP cbox about this, so here is a paraphrase.
http://forums.dctp.ws/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=13211&p=874525#p874525
Mirror dying message = red herring coincidence is interesting, but I think the mirror can still be cracked in a controlled fashion. You press the edge of the scissor to thin glass in order to break it in a controlled fashion under water. And if it was a coincidental fracture from being dropped, where are the missing letter pieces nearby?
But I agree the mirror which has a backing is worrisome. The faucet being on in the "wrong room" may be a signal that the clue could be coincidence, and the faucet was not used at all to crack it. And, while not a real clue, the name of the hotel "Juke" is an English word for "a feint", like a sidestep or trick used to pass someone in football/soccer. It basically means red herring. Yikes!. That leaves us with the hand clue which I think is solid.
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@Otaku3670 I think you are wise to consider the possibility that Wakita is reading something other than the Rumi article. I think the arc is structured so that Wakita will round off the three suspect formula along with Rumi and Kuroda, therefore, I expect him to be reading the Rumi article. I would be less confident if something else important had happened at the same time as the tennis player's case.
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3 hours ago, AnimeOtakuDrew said:First, unless I'm mistaken, the bodies of Haibara's parents were not found after the fire that destroyed their lab (please correct me if I'm wrong, I don't want to spread incorrect information).
Presence or absence of bodies wasn't specified at all. The topic never came up in manga.
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The wiki page for Episode 861 says the episode is based on manga files Volume 89: File 11 (948) ~ Volume 90: File 2 (950)
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I used to prefer Jodie and Akai because I thought they balanced each other's personalities and because they were funny. However, after Akai treated Masumi so coldly on the beach, I realized there was no way they would work. Akai was not someone who responds positively to warmness, and that still seems to be the case.
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The way this case is set up, there isn't a lot of benefit to being the first discoverer. People would just think the first discoverer (aka the young lady) clonked the victim on the head. That would make the younger lady the less likely culprit. The older lady seems like a reasonable suspect. The man went to the kitchen which I assume connects to that little room with four entries. That gives him potential. My guess is that his alibi is going to be related to the cooking he did, and if there is a way to do shortcuts or not. I don't know how to feel yet, so I will pick on the lone male suspect for now.
The victim's shirt collar seems to be wet for some reason which smeared the blood or made a wet surface for the blood to soak through. I'm not sure which case it is. Was he hit, bled a bit and then water dumped on him? The vase was probably moved earlier, making the crime premeditated?
That little room with four doors provides hiding places I guess, so the culprit could go in one door and hide while people moved around or the body was discovered and then pass behind and mingle or something like that.----
Ran's angle.
Sonoko says that maybe they could meet Shinichi in Kyoto. She might be referring to Shinichi Wada, aka Muga Iori, the ninja-like butler of Momiji who lives in Kyoto. Momiji is a rich girl, and thus might be expected to know the Suzuki family and attend Suzuki family functions.
Picture books: it seems like they are trying to judge buildings. One of them was a western building which is an odd choice for Kyoto, which is more known for its traditional architecture. Sonoko has an older sister Ayako Suzuki who is engaged to Yuzo Tomizawa. They are old characters, but they were recently mentioned again in that Kid case where Makoto was a security guard, so they haven't been forgotten. Perhaps they intend to tie the knot in a western style wedding. Sonoko may have been made responsible for researching good locations and asked Ran and Sera to help, explaining the western building and a reason for a rich girl like Momiji and her butler to be present. Attending a wedding is definitely something Conan would be expected to experience when he grows up.
Chapter 1000 may be a wedding event related to the Suzuki's in Kyoto, with Momiji and Iori present, and a case happens.
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Apologies for the double post, but I just remembered there is a disorder which can cause temporary blindness is one eye: Retinal migraine. It seemed weird to me how Rumi was very obvious in how she was searching around right after she recovered from her heavy thoughts in 988. If she is blind in one eye, it's like she isn't used to it. She also didn't appear to have vision problems or overturn in normal circumstances in her earlier chapters. I remember that stress can trigger it, among many other factors. It's a long shot, but maybe worth thinking about?
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6 hours ago, Wakarimashita said:To be consistent with current Wiki standards, it should be written as "Koji Haneda", so basically not the manga version nor the anime version. Still don't understand why it's left as "Kohji" on his character page when the double vowels in romaji spelling weren't kept for Shinichi or Yusaku Kudo, and many other characters, never mind adding an h. Only exception being the Mouris I believe.
Because it was written in the manga as "Kohji."
Being consistent is nice, but there are enough ingrained instances where the wiki deviates from the typical "chop the vowel" that there is little point in trying to claim some standard beyond "we generally do it." Tooru, Hondou, Hyoue - it's common for plot characters.
New editors typically spell names the way they are used to seeing them. Usually that's how they are written in manga or the fan translation version (initial trendsetting). For instance, Shuuichi with two 'u's was a consistent problem back in the Bourbon arc. In the interest of minimizing work, it's better to go with the flow. For contentious cases, we typically take a poll.
The real problem children are the "Helena" people. エレーナ (ere-na) has no starting H -- that would be ヘレーナ.
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@Valentin I think the most important takeaway message here is that Asaka has shogi-related characters, and thus could be used in a clue/dying message.
黒田 兵衛 --> 角行 Hyoue has some of the radicals from bishop for instance.
世良 --> 銀將 family name Sera has a radical found in the silver general piece.
I wonder if there is more dying message, and which piece is in Rumi's pocket.
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2 hours ago, DCUniverseAficionado said:
Looks like the ring finger is longer than the index finger, here.
Honestly they look equal length to me because of the tilt and foreshortening. It's a pretty ambiguous pic (intentionally is my guess). Many people seem to think Asaka looks more busty rather than manly chested when they see the pic. Either way, Asaka is pretty "feminine" looking, be s/he guy or gal.
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14 hours ago, AnimeOtakuDrew said:Also, something else just occurred to me for which I must appeal to anyone able to read Japanese. Something that might give a clue as to Asaka's identity. Do the Kanji used for the name Asaka have any alternate readings? I just realized it was written with Kanji rather than katakana or hiragana, so alternate readings or pronunciations are a possibility. If anyone can say, it might help.
The kanji in the above picture are 淺香
淺 is shallow, superficial. on reading = sen ; kun reading = asa;
香 is incense, smell, perfume. on reading = kou / kyou ; kun reading = ka kao; name reading = ko koo hyan yoshi
Also I'd like to remind people the Volume Scan version of the Asaka exists.
Seems like 浅 and 淺 may have been mixed up in the wiki, but they mean almost the same thing and have the same readings.
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1 hour ago, AnimeOtakuDrew said:Pisco, if I remember correctly, actually saw her change, so his recognition was entirely predictable
No, Pisco first saw her as Ai with Conan when they were trying to get to the front desk to check the guest book. He saw her in the light of camera flashes, despite her wearing Conan's glasses. He then linked up to BO servers using some sort of pre-wifi laptop phone connection (must have been high tech at the time lol) to check her adult appearance. Then he snatched her and locked her in the liquor storage. All of this took place before she transformed.
1 hour ago, AnimeOtakuDrew said:Akai spent a fair amount of time around Haibara before it seemed he was certain that she was actually Shiho
I checked this before, I remember it being a questionable call. Jodie did the most of the nosing around Haibara at first. AI hid from Akai most of the time (huddling up in her jacket hood for example) because she picked up scent from him. He never got a great look until later.
1 hour ago, AnimeOtakuDrew said:I'm convinced that Sherry's escape is only a mystery to the Black Organization grunts and foot soldiers (like Gin and Vodka)
Gin is high ranking. The FBI thought capturing him would lead to the boss, which was to be the culmination of Akai's 3 year BO infiltration mission until Camel blew it. The guidebooks peg Gin highly as "oversight", and Vodka is right under him as his "secretary" (guidebook's term, not mine.)
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3 hours ago, AnimeOtakuDrew said:pretty sure she said that it was not developed as a poison, but she also said she didn't know what its purpose was (please correct me if I'm remembering wrong).
I can 100% guarantee because I went back over the drug chapters semi recently that Ai definitely never said that she didn't know the drug's purpose, she only said that poison wasn't her goal. I assume she does know the end goal because she has some of her parents notes and was asked to create a certain drug. Heck even Pisco knew what the Miyanos were trying to do with their drug.
4 hours ago, AnimeOtakuDrew said:Haibara told Conan that she had to be careful because people from the Organization would know her if they saw her, even in a child's body. At the same time, however, she insists that nobody but her is aware of the de-aging side effect of APTX-4869. If nobody knows a drug can physically turn her into a six year old, she should have no reason to worry about it.
You'd think, but in practice every BO who has a good look at Ai discovered her identity. Vermouth, Pisco, Shuuichi... Even Jodie figured it out from a picture alone. Her hair color is part of the problem tbh.
As for why she lies, I think that she is afraid of what Conan will think of her if he knows the truth of the Org + she is ashamed of what she has done + Conan will use the info and get himself killed and Ai will blame herself for that.
I don't think anyone in the BO willing to talk about it knows the de-aging effects of APTX, or how Ai escaped from the locked room would not be a mystery.
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7 hours ago, MeiTanteixX said:I also thought this was hinting that it was Mary's before(when I supported the "Asaka=Mary" theory), but since that theory has been debunked to me now(not officially ofc), the only way I can see this work is if Mary passed it on to Asaka, who later lent it to Kohji. Since my theory is that Asaka was originally Kohji's bodyguard(before Amanda-meeting in Kohji's room), there's the possibility that Asaka was close to Kohji and the Akai family.
I was thinking more along the lines of Mary Sera/Tsutomu Akai knew the Haneda family. Shuukichi and Kohji may have had some contact before the latter died because Shuukichi respected Kohji, and they were willing to adopt him later, and he took the family name Haneda. Shuukichi would have been 11 at the time Kohji was murdered. My suspicion (and it's only a suspicion) is that Mary loaned the mirror to Kohji at some time because, as Haibara said, "Shogi players care about their looks". Kohji carried it with him routinely during tournis in case a photo-op was coming up, so he had it on him when he was attacked. At least that's my version of events, disclaimers about no evidence noted
7 hours ago, MeiTanteixX said:To me, similarly to your hunches, the idea that the timing of when the photos was taken is important(meaning that Asaka could have taken the photos before fleeing with the hand-mirror) is off. I don't think those kinds of technicalities will have any significance, since Conan never mentioned or wondered about when and by who the photos(specifically) were taken. I believe that Gosho gave us all the important bits to think about in regards to the uploader(following Gosho's M.O with case exposition), and nothing specific about the photos was questioned(meaning they have less likelihood to play a role in the timing of the events).
I doubt that Asaka didn't have a pocket to put the mirror in when she was fleeing anyway. It makes the most sense that she was seen with the hand-mirror while using it.
Conan talks about some important ideas and evidence, but Conan doesn't talk about all the evidence that is important.
I would not be so quick to dismiss the importance of timing and the status of the crime scene. You suggested earlier that Rumi obtained a piece of glass from the crime scene and is hiding it in her back pocket. If she (or someone else) had the ability to take it from the crime scene, that means the crime scene was not completely closed, which means tampering potential and the timing needs to be accounted for. The photographs on the Kohji death website are not stated to be crime scene photos, nor is the information said to be from a police report. Agasa explicitly comments about how in-depth and precise the details are, with the unspoken implication that the uploader may have witnessed the crime scene first hand. If the photographer is not secretly a police officer diverting photos and info, then this 3rd party photographer must have gotten there before the police. If so, how and when did he/she have access to the crime scene? The model case allowed the culprit free time at the end to tamper with the crime scene. While things will not be the same twice, I posted the time allowance for tampering in the list of takeaway possibilities to consider.
Suspicious characters! Discussion about Hyoue Kuroda, Wakasa Rumi, and others.
in Manga series
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Sorry, I didn't mean you as in "you, MeitanteixX". I was using the more informal generic second person pronoun set (you, your, yourself) in place of the formal generic third person set ("one", one's, "oneself") because it sounds excessively formal and kinda pretentious in forum postings. I edited my post.
About the lack of bold lines, I think that means it probably isn't flat with hard edges like a shogi piece, and is instead something more three dimensional and wouldn't cause such lines in a pocket.